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I went to look at a pack of these at a local climbing gym, and...
By Robbie Flick
Ranked #68 - Carabiners, Quickdraws, and Belay Devices
December 6, 2009
I went to look at a pack of these at a local climbing gym, and the guy at the counter scoffed at my decision to buy a draw that didn't have wire biners on both ends. To make his point about gate flutter, he began hitting the solid gate (which you'd clip to the bolt/gear) against the palm of his hand so I could hear it opening.
I understand the concept of gate flutter, but to me it doesn't seem like it'd be an issue on the biner you clip into bolt/gear, as this biner does not gain any significant velocity in a fall and therefore the gate does not gain enough momentum to 'flutter'. For the biner clipped into the rope this makes total sense, but not for the bolt biner...
So, is gate flutter an issue (as was explained to me at the gym) on the bolt biner, and if so, does buying double wire draws increase one's safety significantly?
View Details: Black Diamond QuickWire Quickpack Quickdraws
Helpful Votes: 0 Yes
By Diego Jules
Ranked #357 - Carabiners, Quickdraws, and Belay Devices
August 7, 2010
Great advise from PETZL http://web.archive.org/web/20011007062611/http://www.petzl.com/FRENG/frcarabiners/carabiners.html
Helpful Votes: 0 Yes
By Diego Jules
Ranked #357 - Carabiners, Quickdraws, and Belay Devices
August 7, 2010
I found this cool page with quickdraws usage advice from PETZL. http://web.archive.org/web/20011007062611/http://www.petzl.com/FRENG/frcarabiners/carabiners.html
Helpful Votes: 0 Yes
By Angus Bohanon
Ranked #33 - Carabiners, Quickdraws, and Belay Devices
December 7, 2009
I'm with Lyric. The guy in the gym was just trying to impress you with a "this isn't a joke man, you could die out there" demonstration that was completely irrelevant to the question. These are great draws.
Helpful Votes: 0 Yes
By Robbie Flick
Ranked #68 - Carabiners, Quickdraws, and Belay Devices
December 7, 2009
Makes sense to me...thanks for the helpful answer!
Helpful Votes: 0 Yes
By Lyric Rosatti
Ranked #80 - Carabiners, Quickdraws, and Belay Devices
December 6, 2009
There are technically two types of gate flutter. The first, as you described, is most commonly known as Shutter Gate, and indeed comes from the rope biner's spine hitting the crag in such a fashion that the moment the biner is open, the full force of the fall comes into effect.... Gate flutter seems far more unlikely to me. Gate flutter is when the movement of the rope though a carabiner creates a sympathetic harmonic vibration in the carabiner. Causing the gate to open and close slightly. I'm trying to think of a situation where a loaded draw with rope running through it would A.) see enough shock for it to come into play, or B.) have rope running though the first biner that will catch you have rope running through it before it is loaded with your fall. The scenarios just seem less likely. That said, I agree with you that it is unlikely that the bolt biner will see enough force to open the gate. Your guy at the gym sounds like he was on an ego trip.
Helpful Votes: 0 Yes
Change me.



