I ordered these because I wanted something really aggressive, and that's exactly what these shoes are. These shoes can stand on the smallest chips no problem. The problem lies with me, I think. I first ordered a ten because the smallest street shoe I wear is a ten. This was a mistake. The moment I slipped the shoes on I was in pain. I could not stand up, let alone stand on my toes. So I sent them back and ordered an 11. This time around the pain is less excruciating, but still present. The toe box of these shoes seems to really crunch the big toe. I may have a wide foot or something, because other people don't seem to have a problem. I am keeping them because I can handle the pain for a climb. I have a feeling it will get better anyway. Bottom line, If you can you should try these on in a store first. That isn't possible for many, so I would say take a chance on these shoes anyway because they are amazing, just painful.